| [ The Chinese way: I want to know ] |
© Ernest Ruiz. 2003
This brief article that you're ready to read began as a post in one of the many internet forums devoted to hifi. Some days ago I visited that forum (I'm talking about the forums that are offered for free to audiophiles at the web site of Royal Audio, an spanish audio dealer) and there I found many posts that were talking about Vincent hi-fi products. It was a surprise to see such expectation about these products so I decided to get more information about this brand. In fact, I knew that firm before entering that forum (no, I haven't heard any of the Vicent components, as I have said many times) but I didn't expected to see all these comments. Many of the audiophiles in these forums talked about the great advantages of Vincent products, specially their price, their finishes and their great sound. When I talk about "their price" I mean really good prices (to be exact, cheap). Prices that are difficult to find in the audio market when you search products with the look of the Vincent range. These prices are unusual in high end market and I asked myself how it was possible. The first thing that came into my mind was that maybe the Vincent products were made in the far east, I mean China, because the production costs here in Europa are very high and it is almost impossible to build here these kind of products and to sell them with these prices.
As I said I knew the Vincent brand before entering the Royal Audio forums because it was associated some time ago in some way with Thorens and it was present in their website (maybe this link still works http://www.thorens.com/vincent/sv233/sv233_engl.htm). Also I knew the relation between Vincent and its sister brand TAC (maker of tube amplifiers) with Sintron, a german electronics importer/exporter. many people in the tube audio world has talked about the chinese origin of TAC products, a country that is increasing its presence in the audio world and that is offering excellent products to the audiophile community. So, with all this information and with the question of the Vincent products origin in mind I planned an intensive search on the net in order to find some answers. Another point that focused my attention was the fact that in many web sites, including some sites of official Vincent distributors, the equipment is referred as "Made in Germany", and that was very confusing because both countries were mentioned repeatly.
I know how to use a search engine and it was easy (in fact very easy) to find the relation between Vincent and the chinese manufacturer/brand Shengya Audio. In this site you can see that Vincent products has its origins in the Shengya range of products and that the Vincent name is used to sell them in Europe. I don't think that this is bad because as I said before and in other articles available in this page (see at articles section the article about the visit to Aufiofilo and the contact with Shanling products or the one about Consonance) I believe that chinese manufactures are doing a very good job. I understand that maybe they belive that it would be easy to sell their products in the old continent using an european name, althought I think that it would be better to use their original name for two reasons: first, to won a place with their real name in the audio world (they have to be proud of what they are doing) and second and most important, to avoid confusions. Because some users could be confused when some informations say that a given product is made in Germany and others says that it is made in China. Some of you maybe don't understand my interest in knowing the origin of all these products. Many of you probably don't care about the origin of what you buy because you're satisfied as customers with your products. But I think that is very important to know exactly what we are buying, to know exactly all the facts about the products we own and to ask for all the information if there's some confusion. That's why I have written these lines because I can't understand the reason why this kind of information is hidden, because I want to know.
But all these things never come alone. At the same time I began to search the information about Vincent-Shengya in the net I had a conversation by email with an audiophile who was interested in the "british made" Affordable Valve Company amplifiers. He told me that he was very impressed about the products and he ask me about them. I knew the products from the british magazines I read and I gave him my opinion. He also told me that he had phoned Affordable and that he was surprised to hear that the man who answered his phone call identified himself as chinese. First, I didn't care about that, but suddenly something come to my mind. Chinese? Rapidly I visited again the Affordable web site but now I opened a new internet browser window with the TAC page and oh! surprise, the amplifiers by TAC and Affordable looked the same and had identical configurations. As you can imagine my interest then was focused not only in the Vincent-TAC origin but also in knowing in depth the matter about "Made in China" audio products that come to us here in Europe with non-chinese names or european names.
So I started again my search in the net and after some days of intensive work I found all the information I'm giving to you in the links shown below. I did this work with only one objective in mind, to have information and to give it to you in order to know exactly what some manufacturers are offering and also to know what we are buying. I'm not blaming chinese products only because they come from China. In fact, as I said before, and now I repeat it to be sure that it is clear, I think that they are good products that have to be considered. But we have to know it. All the links are from chinese manufactures (also a few from other asian countries) that are selling their hi-fi products to western countries under their own brands or under OEM products. Here you are.
http://www.tubehifi.com - Antique Sound Lab products sold under the same brand.
http://cattylink.com - A chinese hi-fi central. Here you can see many products from different manufacturers. Original and OEM versions.
http://www.cayin.com - Amplifiers made by Spark Audio sold under the Cayin name.
http://www.daredtube.com/index-e.htm
http://www.korsun.com.cn - As Mr. Mark Levinson (Red Rose Music-RRM) said in some interviews some of the RRM products come are made by Korsun. Compare Korsum products with RRM products that can be found at RRM site.
http://www.aurumcantus.com - Ribbon speakers used in the RRM Rosebud II speaker
http://www.haihuang-audio.com - Aurum Cantus mother company.
http://www.haihuang-audio.com/loudspeaker/hifi/youx2/youx2.htm - Here you can see the original Aurum Cantus speakers that is sold as RRM Rosebud II.
http://www.leoinstruments.com.hk
http://www.shengya-audio.com - I started this search with this brand.
http://www.sparkaudio.com/ - Spark amplifiers. They make the Cayin amps.
As you can see this is a very short list. There're many more chinese manufacturers in the net selling their OEM products to other hifi industries all around the world. My work is only a fast view into this matter. You can follow the search by yourself and so I would give you some advice. First download the chinese characters for your browser. This will allow the browser to show properly the pages written in chinese. Second, use always english to seacrh for these issues. All the chinese sites are written in chinese but also in english and it's better to seacrh using this language. Third, search using numerical names. For example if you want to know the origin of an amplifier called "Mark SP-V456", type in the search engine "sp-v456 +amplifier". Some manufacturers change the name of the amplifier from the original chinese name to an european/western name but they don't change the number of the model (the same happen to DVD players).
Finaly, before buying any product get as much information about it as you can and ask the dealers or the importers all the questions you have about that product. Doing this we'll be more secure as customers about what we buy.
07/09/2003- While writing this article I contacted Sintron, the european importer of Shengya products, to ask them about their products and this is the answer I have received. Thanks to Sintron for this information:
Dear Mr. Ruiz,
We are pleased to notice your interest in our Hi-Fi Products and see below for your question! Production place China as like more and more brands do, of course. Shengya are different to Vincent although the housings are temporatly the same which are able to give confused but shouldn't happened as far as Shengya wouldn't and couldn't be commercialize in Europe. Enginering by co-venture as well as technical modifications/specifications are concerned and these are relevant under industrial secret. Best regards. Olivier Kasjan//SINTRON.
09/09/2003- More information about Shengya, kindly provided by the chinese company. Thanks very much to Shengya:
Dear Mr. Ruiz,
Thanks for your Email! Yes, that's true about your questions! 1. Vincent products are made by us in China and all the design is different with Shengya and Vincent produts are sale in Europe by Sintron. 2. Whats the different between them? Some of them IC/capacitor/transformer/tube/remote control etc. Of course, they will more better in Vincent and more expensive. Any questions pls don't hesitate to contact us! Thank you! BRGD Abby_Jiang.
27/01/2004- More concidences with this two manufacturers: